major win last week. I think it shocked everyone and yet was not surprising because you guys came out and just completely dominated. So I'd love to hear the perspective on that win for Nigeria over Team Usa especially in an exhibition game leading up to the olympics. Yeah, I mean I think uh yeah, it was just one of those games where I think we're just very prepared. You know, we came to the game but we took it very seriously and it was it was in a moment where you play against like your idol or somebody that you think is better than you and then you get starstruck or you just get nervous or anything like that. I think everybody on our team that took the floor was just you know, an extreme confidence in, I was able to just play just like it was just another game, you know, and the end result showed that. Yeah, and there was one moment, there was 7:46 left on the clock, 68-68. And you came up for Draymond green and just landed down. And to me that was kind of, that was kind of the moment of the game where it was like just complete domination. So what was going through your head in that moment? Um and in different moments throughout the game where you're realizing you guys had this, you had this game in the bag and I just, I just want to stay aggressive and remember checking the score, you know, after every possession, I'll check the scorer. And remember after that play, remember either put us up to or try to tie this up. Like you said 66/8, so I guess to put us up to. Yeah, but I knew that like plays like that would give us energy. Like we had a lot of players like that, like precious had a great block against Katie. Um like I had a dark highlight. We had a lot of big shots made like difficult ones as well. So I think just a little moments like that this capital is going and it gave us more energy to finish out the game because at the very end they made a little run and um Who knows what happened if there's a lot more time. But you know, there's 40 minutes in the European game. So it worked out and you talked a little bit about the difference between a european game and the different rules and different styles, different courts set up. How do you think that played a factor about your ability to come in? I know you guys said, are you specifically said that your defense was a strong factor and the offense to clearly you have to have both to win? But how do you think that that difference in the overall structure of the game played? Yeah, well the three point line is a little closer and Fiba in international play. So um, it makes the courts seem a little bit smaller, you know, people aren't really shooting from so far out So it compacts defense. And also there's a big difference in the rules where in the NBA defensive three seconds rule where if you're in the and the painted area for more than three seconds then as a technical foul, if it's not close enough for like an arm's reach of an offensive player. So uh that being said, we're able to just sit in the paint and you know, over helped pretty much any situation. And the way that they were playing that get that day was a lot of one on one basketball. So whenever they attack the basket, somebody else met them at the at the ramp versus you know, somebody come running from outside of the paint like it is an NBA to come and try to contest the shot. Is it more difficult? And a lot of times people get dunked on a lot in the NBA because of this? Yeah, definitely. And one other thing that was a big discussion around this game is, although it was just exhibition, a part of the whole olympic structure is countries versus countries. And I know that this game specifically was symbolic and it was historic and you guys had the nelson Mandela quote backing you up and a lot of really pushing that symbolism. So can you talk a little bit about that, about how this game, even though in the end maybe it's, you know, not quite the olympic stage. It's incredibly significant for for a lot of people. Yeah, I mean just traditionally clinic against them, it's never been close. It's always been lopsided whenever they play a team from Africa. Um maybe in the past the most competitive teams I said I say outside of the last eight years the most competitive teams have been Tunisia and Angola. They usually dominated Africa. But you know, during this this new era of Nigerian basketball where you know, a lot of players are coming and playing with the national team representing our country, we've been able to take that over. And I think that uh Nigeria is like huge, huge, huge like yeah breeding ground for basketball. I guess if you want to say it, like there's so many Nigerians that I know personally that play basketball, the cheese might may see in the N C double A overseas in an NBA. So with that being said, the game could be pioneered from our country, you know, to grow in africa if the resources were put there and you know, the same opportunities were given like like we have here, like if I've been to Nigeria 10 10 10 times, uh it's very rare that you see a court on the side of the road. But growing up I had a basketball court in my in my front yard, you know, my neighbor had a goal. Like everywhere you go, you see you see a basketball court and it's so it's so easy to just get up shots to just play for fun and there they make their own goals in a lot of places like they have a national stadium where they have games and things like that. But for the average kid that's trying to practice and you know, go to skills to, you know, one day join the team is very, very difficult. So I think those resources are putting in place, who knows, who knows what the future in Nigeria basketball. Yeah. And with a look like this, do you think that seeing you guys dominate in the way you did and and having this now, you know, history being broken and a clear shift, do you think that will make a difference for maybe young kids seeing that and seeing how the Nigerian team can, can come out and clearly have these professional, incredible athletes like yourself dominating a team that people kind of assume, you know, gold usa basketball, you know, dream team, whatever phrase you want to throw out and this was just, you know, you guys played them you want and and that's how it how it went. Yeah, I think uh, games like this or situations like this always, uh, serve as like motivation for young kids to go out and, you know, change the dream like this. But it also for, you know, the older generation, for those who are thinking more business or professional, um, it's a great opportunity for somebody to step in and like invest in Nigerian basketball. You know, like I was saying before, help grow the game of basketball in Nigeria or find some type of, there's a, there's already programs in place that have basketball without borders. They have the NBA Africa. They're, they're trying, you know, to find a grassroots connection where, you know, players are able to come over, you know, and go to college, even some go to high schools and start from there in the United States, but I think there needs to be these systems in place in africa, not only in Nigeria. Yeah, for sure. In speaking of motivation and being an inspiration, I know your instagram bio, you say the marathon continues. So what does that mean to you? I know that throughout your career you've played for different teams, you've represented so many different things. So how do you think that this idea of the marathon continues to play a factor in your life and in your career? That's a great question hasn't been asked that. But you know, obviously that quote came from like one of my favorite rappers who passed away a year or two ago and uh his name is Nipsey hustle and That, that quote stood out to me like 10 years ago when I first heard, it he always said it and it just, it works in every aspect of like, like you can't rush anything like life is literally a marathon is a bunch of different segments and some sometimes you may you may push harder here, sometimes you might have to sit back and like art, I got to pace myself, but in the end it's never sprint, it's a long race and that's how my life has been, especially my career and by uh you know, coming from a Dell high school, being, not being recruited by my big schools, one of the main military institute, having that same type of struggle trying to become a professional athlete and then once I became a professional athlete, you know, trying to work my way up in europe to get up to the highest level possible. And you know the same way with my experiences with Nigerian basketball team. And It's a tough question but obviously not making it on that final cut this year, having represented Nigeria at the Rio Olympics. Do you see this as just you know, mile 20 in your marathon? You've got you know, another four years will be another Olympics. There'll be so many more things ahead. How does not making the final roster this year? How does that feel in your overall process and path? Yeah, I mean personally obviously it hurt, you know, I would love to be out there competing with my teammates, you know, after putting in eight years with the team. But I think it's just a it's just a signal that I can be comfortable, you know, that also these young guys who are coming in uh just as hungry as I was when I was their age. So it's just a change of guards almost. But at the same time it's like I just have to work hard and and and never ever get comfortable in this game because that's the way that's the way this is about, you know, you've seen it in all sports, that's way uh athletes, athletes are, are treated or I mean, I'm not saying anything was done wrong, but at the same time, it's just like anybody is replaceable and if somebody is performing better than you at that time, uh they probably deserve the opportunity. So it's just a reality check that, you know, I was going to bring him next time. I'm not sure We're all being in the next three years and 20, fixed, but but we'll see. Yeah, well, hey, it's in, in four years, maybe I'll hit you up for another interview and it will be, you know, a different thing. You'll be, you'll be there wherever and maybe in paris we'll see. But uh Yeah, it's, I'm sure a crazy thing and you made it on that 16 man roster, which in itself is an incredible feat. Um, but dating it back a little bit. One thing that I know you talked about before having, um played and growing up in Raleigh and in north Carolina, um, and then playing at B. M. I Virginia Military Institute. Um, it was definitely, I think a factor being a person of color and being in a state like north Carolina where sometimes just be expected in the typical way of talking and acting. You mentioned confederate symbolism around and and having to recreate certain, you know, historic moments. How did that play a factor growing up in, you know, in a certain place and meeting, you know, in a, in a system that has incredibly ingrained racism and problems? Well, I mean when I was very young, I really don't understand what was going on. You know, this little things like being questioned when walking in the grocery store where I was when I was alone without my parents. You know, just trying to buy some candy or something like that. You know, being followed around things like that when I'm shopping as a teenager for clothes at the mall, I didn't really understand that was being targeted because of like the color of my skin until a little bit later. Um, and things like that. They put like they put a lot of pressure on someone like me to be perfect. Um, everybody, I mean, not that I was, I was making making a thing at the time, but you just feel like you have to be on point and everything you're doing. You know, I remember several times, you know, high school going home from basketball practice and being pulled over by police immediately leaving campus and the officers like I smell marijuana and nobody I know smokes marijuana. You know, things like that. So just having encounters like that, being pulled out of the car and, and search and being accused of being a gang member, things like that. So, um, fast forward to VM. I um, going to Virginia, which is a little more conservative than uh, north Carolina is not too far off because they're pretty similar. But you know, I was in Lexington, very tiny town and there's a lot of military history there and you know, those who don't know Virginia military is known there for having cadets fighting that in the civil war representing the confederate army. So they traditionally always had these uh, events and rituals where you would recreate, re enact one of the battles, the battle Newmarket and you run across the field where the cadets had charged against the union and stuff like that. And then also as a freshman, you're forced to memorize the names of the cadets who lost their lives, um, in the, in that war. Um, and then, I mean obviously the statues of Stonewall Jackson and all these military leaders of the, the confederate army. So you know, first coming in, I didn't know the history too well. But as I learned more and you know, we talked about these different things at school. I realized that, you know, I think that the school was on the wrong side of things and to see recently they made some adjustments or plan to make some adjustments. I think, uh, it's a good symbol change. Obviously everybody's not going to change being at home. I still have the same experiences, you know, but I think it's getting a little better. and when you think back to being a young man and experiencing a lot of that, do you see a value and now getting to represent Nigeria and I know your parents are from there and you had mentioned already in this interview that you have been going there your entire life and and seeing two very different ways of life. So do you think now getting to represent Nigeria on the national and international stage in a way that you've been able to in the past decade means something means something to your younger self and to your current self, definitely. Um growing up, I never, you know, as a kid, I had dreams, every like every kid has dreams, like you're watching the olympics as a kid and you wanna you just wanna participate, you don't know what sport you want to play at the time when you're so young, you see gymnastics, you see track, you see swimming, basketball, all these different events and you're just like yeah one day I would love to be on stage like this. Um let's have the actual opportunity to be out there um and represent a country. You know, The feeling is very different. I remember in 2016 when we went there were preparing, we all learned the Nigerian national anthem and I didn't know it before then and it's the words and the anthem just meant that so much like serving your father's land, love strength and faith. Uh all these all these different, different words like just they are powerful. Like people get emotional when they repeat these words is very different than american national anthem because of what I know it has been founded upon, you know on the backs of slaves and things like that. So uh to be able to represent my parents country, my country as well. You know it's a very very uh special thing. Every time I put on the jersey my parents are happy. My relatives are writing me on facebook WhatsApp you know just like showing so much love and I know it makes them more happy than it makes me which gives me satisfaction. So it's dope. Yeah and I think one of the most amazing things about the olympics is you have this new link every four years or two years including the winter olympics among countries. And you become aware of different cultures and you see a lot of people who are from the U. S. Or or american but who get to really kind of dig deep into their roots and and represent something that that means a lot to them and then you have a win like last week where you know there's there's more to it than just you know oh USA showing a little flaws. It's you know it has a lot a lot more symbolism and just um and another thing I love to touch on is clearly beating the U. S. You saw some weaknesses. Um So when people you know think about how the U. S. Team is a shoeing for gold, what's your take on that? When you when you think about playing against them and seeing you know, a few moments where you guys were able to key in, what are you what are your prospects in thinking for how the games might go? Uh it's tough to predict who will win. Um I can say that I participated in the 2019 World Cup. You know, USA was also there and you know watching that performance there. It just shows that uh the international game has gotten a lot stronger. I want to say that the international game is better than the NBA. But I mean a great percentage of NBA players now are from other countries anyway. Um but we saw like the poor performance that they put on And China two years ago and Spain ended up winning that championship. Um it's hard to predict now. The team is a little different. They have a more all stars, more superstar players on the team now, but I think that there's so many other teams that have a chance to go out there metal, you know, not being biased. I think Nigeria still has without me still has a great chance. You've got me bring for Nigeria now, don't tell anyone, but I mean it's not too seeing that and uh getting to talk to you. I've got personal stakes in it now. Um, another thing that you, I think it meant, I could say that, sorry, go ahead. I think cut off for a second. I was gonna say, like, other than that, I think other than Nigeria, us whatever. I think Argentina Spain and um, Australia have great chances to meddle. So it's so balanced. Looking at the groups is going to be like a very entertaining competition. And you mentioned that when you were a kid, you watched a lot of the sports and thought, you know, maybe you'd be interested in in many of them. So, looking forward to this olympics. What are some teams events competitions that you're kind of excited to see? Uh, other than all, it's tough because, you know, a lot of, uh, well, there's a lot of athletes who are able to participate because of Covid and also, you know, the great usa track runner, track sprinter who can't go anymore. Uh, I wanted to see that competition, you know, and it's different cause like, you know, like now, obviously, like Michael Phelps is gonna be there, you're saying, but it's not gonna be there were tired. So like, I just want to see who the new the new stars will be, you know, and all those competitions. So like in in in track and gymnastics, I think USA will dominate that. Like always swimming. I just want to see what the new stars are. Yeah. I think this year, especially after this past year of all the insanity that it was, there does seem to be kind of this expectation of a newness to this olympics and whether that's kind of the fact that we're getting to see some sports and we finally get the olympics after a delay and also a lot of younger, younger athletes. So I think you're right, that that will be interesting to see the new characters that kind of kind of it all. Um one thing to look back on, because I think the important part of this conversation was less even sports itself and more kind of the significance behind it. You would mention that one thing was not celebrating too much on the court and and preserving this specific image while you were playing while things were happening. So what was the thinking behind that? Behind trying to project a certain image of yourself and your team in that competition? I mean, first of all, it was just an exhibition game for one, and then also like we have to show class, you know, obviously we won the game and you know, it was a special moment but You know we can't forget that they beat us by 83, You know in 2012 and then when we played them in 2016, another exhibition game, they beat us by ridiculous amount, maybe like 50 or 60 points. So it's like you know you always have to remain humble and we still to possibly the team could still possibly face them again in Tokyo, you know after after the group stage. So ah and also I mean you also you don't want to no, no I never really uh I felt like there was a need to celebrate until you wanted like a championship. You know what that shows that all the work has been done and the mission has been accomplished. You know it's cool to you know celebrate but you know you do that on your own.