welcome, welcome. Welcome. It is not five o'clock on a Monday. Uh but this is still W R L's triangle in two. I'm Luis Hernandez. He's Mark Bergan. Uh Mar, we were joking and maybe next week we'll have to do an emergency pod with N L L free agency and everything like that. Well, the NFL is a 365 day league and the Carolina Panthers, uh proved that to us today massive trade for the Panthers for the NFL MARK. You've got the details in front of you. Why don't you, you let us All right, the Panthers have a decision to make Lewis because really there's four possibilities five if the Panthers were to trade back now that they have the number one overall pick from the Bears. Here's what they need to decide. You got 44 choices at the quarterback position. CJ. Strat out of Ohio State, Bryce Young out of Alabama, Florida's Anthony Richardson will Levis out of Kentucky. You're gonna have to pick one. We talked about it on our last triangle in two episodes, but Lewis, The Panthers were at, at number nine, there was a strong possibility that none of those four stud quarterbacks was going to be there at nine. That's why you trade up and pay a king's ransom to the Bears to get the first overall pick. Now, what I'm excited to see is who is the quarterback that the Panthers are targeting to where they had to go all the way to number one and give up everything that they did in this Blockbuster deal that broke today. it's, it's a lot and it, it is, it is a lot that they traded. Um Do you have the, the trade details in front of you? Yes, let me go through that really quickly. So they, the Panthers get the first overall pick in exchange. The Bearss get the ninth overall pick. That's a first round pick. They'll get the 61st pick as well. The Bears will get a first round pick and a second round pick in next year's draft in 2024 and they get a receiver DJ Moore as well. And Lewis, this is a very weak free agent wide receiver class. So the Bears needed to get another target for Justin Fields because you get Chase Clay Pool in a trade with the Packers or excuse me, a trade with the Steelers uh in the middle of last season, Darnell Mooney is a decent receiver but you get fields. Another target fields has got two. more years left on his rookie contract. So the Bears are going to see is he truly the guy and they're finally starting to get pieces that they'll be able to surround him with to have success from the Panthers standpoint though. Let me focus on this Lewis post, Cam Newton era. The Panthers have been looking for a guy didn't work out with Teddy Bridgewater next offseason. You bring in Sam Arnold didn't work out with him. Oh, Let's get Baker Mayfield for 10 cents on the dollar. Let's make the Browns pay his contract. I mentioned this on the last show Lewis, the Panthers last season allocated the 10th most amount of money to the quarterback position of any team in the league. You started Mayfield Arnold and P J Walker last year, the Panthers did not get the 10th best production at the quarterback position. That's why when you bring in, New head coach Frank Wright, you're gonna get him a young rookie quarterback from the jump to develop from day one now with this trade. Exactly. And I think too it's, it's about the big picture with the Panthers. Right. I, I've seen some people a little bit frustrated by this trade say, oh, the Panthers gave up so much and, and don't get me wrong losing DJ Moore, that hurts DJ Moore is a very talented receiver, uh, you know, a true ex receiver who is gonna be able to line up on the outside and win you one on one matchups. So that, that is hard. But in this league, you are either you have a quarterback or you don't have a quarterback there, there is no in between. If you, the only way it works, if you're in between, if you're like the 49 Ers and you know, you've got uh Kyle Shanahan who's just like an offensive wizard. Uh if you do not have the guy, then you are in trouble. And, you know, you look at this class, I don't think as strong as next year's class, but the Panthers, they can't tank like it is so much harder to tank in the NFL than it is in like the NBA or something. And if you have the first pick or the second pick in the NFL draft next year, you're gonna pick Caleb Williams or you're gonna pick Drake May. There is you're not gonna, you're either you're not gonna trade those away and if you do, you're trading it for picks upon picks upon picks I, I just, I think it's smart to capitalize when you have the opportunity now for the Panthers, especially because there are some, you know, good quarterbacks in this draft that I think at the very least are gonna give them an opportunity to have the most success they've had since those, you know, 2015 2016, Cam Newton, uh prime years, uh because they, they have a good team, but now the question of course, will be A well, a who do they pick? And b what do they surround them with? Because, uh, that, that is the one thing losing DJ Moore does kind of puts you in a tricky situation when it comes to, to weapons, uh, for, for a quarterback to use on offense with the quarterback though, Lewis, it greatly hamstrings your ability to win in the NFL if you don't have a stud, single signal caller. And that's evident for the premium that you see Derek Car get, you see the massive extension signed by Daniel Jones and Geno Smith quarterbacks who are good. I would not consider them elite or great quarterbacks, but there's a reason because there's a premium in this league. And if you're gonna get a true blue chip quarterback who can make a difference, I'm gonna make it a baseball analogy here for you, Lewis. You can't knock one out of the park if you don't swing for the fences and you had to make a move here if you're the Panthers because you couldn't risk being at number nine. and not being able to move up in this draft to get one of the four and go into next season. Expect to have success. It's that simple. I, I, I just think it would be too, uh, you, you don't want your franchise to just keep kicking the can down the road, especially when it would require being one of the two worst teams in the NFL next year. And with what we see of the NFC South, if the Panthers improve slightly, they're not gonna be struggling in the division to get wins or something like that. It's it would be hard for them to get Caleb blames or, or Drake May if you can guarantee you're gonna get those two next year. Yeah, for sure. Pass on this one. Say we're good, we'll go get the next guy, but I, I, I think there are a lot of opportunities here for them to do that, especially when you look at the grand scheme in the NFL, right. The AFC loaded with quarterbacks, you just go division by division and it feels like, you know, six of the top seven guys are all in the AFC. what do you have in the NFC Jalen Hurtz is very good. Sure. Uh Dak Prescott, pretty solid. Ok. Look at the NFC South. Tom Brady left Derek Carr is probably gonna be a starter. And then who else do you have? You know what I mean? You, you look at the, um, the NFC West Kyler Murray just tore his AC L Will, Trey Lance or Jimmy Garoppolo or Brock Purdy. What's gonna happen with the 49ers Rams? What's going on? Matt Stafford's health like there Aaron Rodgers maybe going to the AFC. There is so much room to find success in the NFC. I, I love this move by the Panthers. I think this is smart. I think this is deliberate. I think they know exactly who they're gonna get with that number one pick already. Lewis, I'll take this a step further and I'll say this for you, um, In comparison, the AFC quarterbacks to the NFC quarterbacks, one is a gauntlet and another is a desolate wasteland and I'll let you figure out the two because, and it's the simple way to do it, but in the postseason it's a lot of times it's which team has the better quarterback if you're truly going to win in the league. And I'm with you there too. I think the Panthers already know who it's going to be. I think that the biggest swing would be Anthony Richardson. Well, let me, let me ask you, ok, if, if, if I said, hey, Mark, uh, uh, you know, you just traveled from the, from the future. You were there on the first pick in the NFL draft this year. Who did the Panthers get? What, what's, what's your choice? I hate to side with you because on our last show, you were mentioning CJ Stroud and I think it makes all the sense of the world, but I think Stroud and Richardson would make the most sense and this is no knock on Bryce Young, but it's, if you're not gonna have pieces around him and you're not able to protect him, he's a, he's an undersized quarterback. There's no way around that in terms of his height and weight, protecting a young quarterback and putting a player in a position to succeed I, I think Stroud would probably be most pro ready. Like you said, I, I said this on our last show. I took some flak for it in the comments and it's fine. I mentioned Levis and this is when the Panthers had the ninth pick because at that point at nine, you maybe had a chance at Levis, maybe had a chance at Richardson. Stroud and Young are gonna be gone by that point. Lewis but Levis, I'm telling you if you go through the right system He could very well be like a Justin Herbert or Justin Herbert was coming out of the league wasn't talked about. And then once you saw it on tape and once you saw him out there making all these crazy throws, he goes to the right system. Um, but I think it's gonna be Strater Richardson. That's if it was Bryce Young, I would be surprised Lewis, I'll just put it that way just given. We're probably gonna make more of his size than we need to. I know the rules have changed and you could say, well, what about Russell Wilson? What about Kyler Murray Drew Brees? Those guys are the exception, not the norm when it comes to younger. Uh, uh, excuse me, when it comes to undersized quarterbacks in this league. Yeah, I think if, if you're gonna get the number one pick in the draft, not, not just ok, you were bad a year and you got the pick if you are going to trade up and give up that many picks for the number one pick, which I will say, I, I do think that picks are overvalued to an extent. So I have no problem giving up picks. If there's a guy, you know, you wanna get, But I, you have to go with someone who you think is that right? Combination of potential and not a guarantee because there are no guarantees in this league. We see top 10 picks playing out all the time, but you, you need someone who you feel confident about. And if you have questions about Bryce Young's size, about arm strength, whatever it might be. Ok. I understand that. And I don't, I don't, I, I, and I get that and that's why I do think it's gonna be CJ Stroud. Um, and when you look at the size, when you look at the capabilities, what he can do, I mean, he, he went up there against Georgia in the, you know, college football playoffs, Georgia who absolutely crushed T C U in the national championship game, Georgia who back to back national champions, one of the best defenses you'll ever see, Through for 348 yards, completed 67% of his passes had four touchdowns. like it from a pure pocket passer perspective. He's the best pure pocket passer in this draft. And I think that it's kind of like the framework that someone like Frank Reich is gonna just, you know, salivate over Lewis if let's give you the keys to the Cadillac for a second, is that the decision you would make if the, if the Panthers came to you and said, hey, who should we take number one of all? Would it be stroud? Yep. I, I am writing down that name already I, I think C G is your guy. No, I mean, like for real, I, I, so and here is, here is what I was a little behind the scenes before we got started, Mark, I was telling you, I was watching a video really quick before we got, we got here. Um There is uh the underdog uh underdog network, underdog Podcast Network. Um Josh Norris, he had this show last year. It was called Scheme, I believe. And he hosted it with Josh mccown the current quarterbacks coach for the Panthers and he absolute, they did an episode of breaking down CJ. Stroud. He absolutely loved CJ Stroud and what he brought to the table. You're already finding the connections. Lewis and John, that was a court. Um He had a lot of NFL experience as well in league is a quarterback in his own, right? Not just as a, as a coach. Exactly. Well, and, and he, what he said in this specific podcast was that physically CJ Stroud reminded him a lot of Joe Burrow in terms of his distribution ability, his physical size, his arm strength, not the top tier, Patrick Mahomes, Josh Allen arm, but still make almost every throw. You need him to the ability to layer passes, the ability to read defenses move off of that first read, get the guy, you know, get the ball to the next guy. Um, and, and what he said at the very end was, he's like, I know a lot of people are putting Bryce Young at the top of their leader board right now, but it would not surprise me if CJ S crowd closes that gap before the start of the NFL draft. any possibility that the Panthers would consider trading back now that they have number one and going full draft day. The great movie, the cult classic with Kevin Costner negative that no, there's no way I, at this point I think, I think it's, you know, you, you get up there, you make this trade because you know who you're gonna get like you, you know, I'm with you there, but we know when this gets it further into the new cycle Lewis when we get closer and closer to April the 27th, it's gonna be like, Oh, should they do it because of all the possibilities that are out there. Now, I'll say this though too. And if you think the Panthers gave up too much again, think about it from # nine. from number nine, you weren't gonna get one of the four studs. And then Lewis, we've talked about this off the air when we're in the W R A L newsroom where it's like, are we now on Carson Wentz's watch? Are we now on Jimmy G watch? You know, before Derek Carr was going to go to the Saints, he was another possibility for the Saints or excuse me before he went to the Saints. He was another possibility for the Panthers and it's like time and time and time again. the Panthers have tried to do the same thing. Post Cam Newton again with Bridgewater, with Arnold, with Mayfield. The fact that P J Walker actually looked, I would argue most competent at times. He was either him or darnd this past season again. when the Panthers traded for Mayfield and I don't fault the Panthers from doing that, uh a year ago, It was if you look at that one individual move, Cleveland paid most of Mayfield's salary and it's like, oh, wow. Well, maybe you find a diamond in the rough, but then when you look again at the salary cap allocation overall for the Panthers ranked 10th in the NFL last season and you didn't have the 10th best quarterback play in the league. It's that simple because of the ransom that you gave up to sign Bridgewater to sign Arnold to bring in all these other players, correct. Got hurt. He was a draft pick a year ago too. So you got Matt Corral and Jacob be, are your two quarterbacks that are currently under contract right now? Clearly, the Panthers are going to use this first overall pick on a quarterback too. So it's like if you hear any fodder of like, well, should they, should they go after one of the defensive studs? It's like, no, it's gonna be a quarterback, no doubt in my mind. Well, and, and I think what's important too is the timing of this. Uh, it's March, what was we were recording this? It's March. 10th. Um, and free agency starts in less than a week. So now you go into free agency knowing, hey, we're gonna get a rookie quarterback on their rookie deal. We can focus on other positions. It's, it's the same reason why I think the Bears decided to make this trade already and they know, ok, we got DJ Moore, we got a few more picks out there. Now we can focus on shoring up the offensive line for Justin Fields. I mean, I, I know this isn't a Bears podcast but that, that bears offense is kind of, Nice if they can get an offensive line that like is legit. Oh, that's, you know, I, I, I, I really like what the Bears are doing but regardless besides the point, um I, I just, I think that now the Panthers can really dive in and focus with the hope that they know who the face of their franchise is gonna be. My, my only hesitations right now with CJ Stroud, are we, we didn't see a whole lot of out of pocket mobility. in terms of running the ball. Um, you know, he, he wasn't, he's not exactly like, you know, a 30 some odd year old Matt Ryan in the pocket, but he, he wasn't, you know, as mobile as maybe some guys you might like. But what he is able to do is he's able to move well within the pocket. He has a lot of his mobility is well suited for someone who is a distributor of the football who gets the ball in the places that needs to be number one. And then there has been some lack of major success with Ohio State quarterbacks in recent years. Justin Fields, obviously, has had a good season last year but was hurt, has had some struggle passing. Um, you know, his rookie year was a little bit up and down Um, the, uh, you know, the most successful quarterback I think from Ohio State in recent memory is Joe Burrow, you know, who is a transfer and only there for a little bit. Um And then of course, just the sheer amount of talent that you work with at Ohio State, look at the receivers he had a chance to throw to over these past couple of years, Chris Olave Garrett Wilson. Marvin Harrison junior who's probably gonna be like a top three pick when he leaves next year. Uh, I just, that, that would be my only hang up about CJ straw but in my mind, sign seal delivered. Get CJ stroud a number. What was he in college? Was he, was he like number seven or something like that? Yes. Yes, sir. Who's, who's got the number seven jersey? Let's go ahead and, and get that out Well, Lewis, let, let me take this a step further too. Let's look at the division right now. Kyle Trask is gonna be the starter for the Buccaneers. I don't think that will stick but OK, Derek Carr is probably the best starter in the division. Ok. He's above average to good when he's at his best. He didn't have a very good season this past year. and then the Falcons have a huge question mark because Marcus Mariota is not gonna be back. So there's a huge void in the NFC South. If you can even be 500 which you were this past season, you could potentially get into the playoffs again because this was a very weak division this past year. So there's not gonna like to me this is a power play of not just we were talking earlier about the dynamics between the AFC and NFC quarterbacks. Well, look at the quarterbacks within the NFC South division over all the teams that you have to play twice a year. Yeah, I mean, it's I think the goal whenever you draft a rookie quarterback is to have them get as ready as soon as possible, step in and kind of fall into that prototypical rookie quarterback situation that we've seen success with the. Matt Ryan is his rookie year, the Ben Roethlisberger, his rookie year, uh you know, uh Payton through a lot of receptions, his rookie, but, you know, someone like Tom Brady coming in very early on in his career, someone who can, you know, make the offense tick, learn, grow and then have a defense that can support them in the process and you know, I, I think the Panthers are now in a prime position to be able to do that. Um, and I, I don't know, I, if, if I were a Panthers fan, I would be very, very excited right now. I would much rather my team take some risks and go up and, and try and do something that's gonna ultimately knock you out of NFL purgatory. Because if you got that guy, congratulations, you're gonna be a good team for the next 15 years. Yeah, and the rest of this stuff doesn't matter, matter to where this upcoming season. Let's be honest, it's not like the Panthers were gonna compete for a Super Bowl anyways. So if you get a guy like a Joe Burrow, I mean, that's the probably the classic case scenario of a number one pick of someone who completely transformed a Bengals franchise that was really desolate in the post. Carson Palmer, Chao Chosin Husman Zada high flying offense years, Um, um You know, Andy Dalton salvaged that a little bit but what one blue chip true difference maker at a quarterback position, all the difference that that makes because then it's just, and, and you know, it, when you see it in the NFL and sometimes it's not there right away. Joe Burrow got hurt. His rookie year but he came back his second year and then takes his team to the Super Bowl, had the Bengals in the playoffs again. So it's like that to me is like whoever the Panthers end up drafting, that's the potential of the stakes that you're talking about. Purgatory was the perfect word to use right there. Lewis of where the, where the Panthers were stuck because again, we said this right from the jump of this recording. If you don't have a true difference maker at the quarterback position, it greatly limits your ability, not just to win but to contend into hoist Lombardi trophies, which is what every team's trying to do come season. Then if you're not getting better, you're, you're getting worse. That's kind of how, how I look at it and I think that the Panthers have, have proven that they want to get better. Um, you know, and just kind of looking at the back of the Panthers draft history, by the way, right. You've got with picks this high in the draft. Uh, they picked Julius Peppers, uh, picked number two in 2002. Future Hall of Famer. Uh, as far as I'm concerned, they had the number one pick when they went to an expansion, uh, when they were the expansion team, uh, they traded it to the Bengals actually dropped back out carry Collins and picked four in the first round Um, they, they have a history of hitting with these top end first round picks. I Cam Newton in 2011. Obviously, he was picked number one. Not that, that was exactly a difficult pick. Luke Keeley was a top 10 pick. So the Panthers have shown Christian mccaffrey top 10 pick. I'm scrolling through their, their uh draft history here. Uh The Panthers have shown the ability to, pick well, when they have a top end draft pick. So that's, I'll, you know, it's March 10th, I'll, I'll go down and saying, I think it's CJ S dr just straight up. All right. Listen, and I'm gonna have to make the case for Richardson and the more and more you see of him where it's just like that to me would be, he's more of the true development and I'll say this too. if you did draft Anthony Richardson, you'd probably need to bring someone in as like a bridge quarterback to like start the season, show him the ropes of what it takes to be a pro because he's the type of prospect and this might not be popular to hear when you have a first round draft pick, but not every rookie is designed to come in right away and start from week one. The Panthers are likely going to need that, which is why I'm kind of siding with you a little bit here. Lewis, that CJ Stroud will likely be the guy. Not every stud quarterback starts, week one right away. Patrick Mahomes did start. Uh Tom Brady obviously is 1/6 round pick Roethlisberger back in the day. Um, you had the flip side of that where you see, you know, the Joe Burroughs, the Peyton Mannings of the world. Uh, each quarterback's a little bit different. Each quarterback's a little bit different. Panthers are likely going to need whoever they draft first overall to come in and start day one. And if that's the case, I do think Stroud will be the guy and I am with you too. I think the Panthers know at this moment in time right now who it is that they want? I have no doubt in my mind about you better. You don't, you don't trade up this. If you don't trade up this high to the, the number one pick in the draft would be like, I think it's gonna be, then that's the thing too is to trade up to number one specifically as well because they could have traded up. Like, for example, right. Houston has two first round draft picks. What are they picking at, uh, two or three at number two? So you, they don't want to risk anyone else getting who they now have the opportunity to draft at number one overall and. What? Crazy news on a Friday Lewis. It's just as soon as soon as you start, it's like we have to do an emergency pod episode number two, we have to get it out there for our listeners and viewers. Yep. And I'm sure we'll be talking more about this. Uh coming up, but, uh, for everyone who has been watching, thank you so much, for watching. I'm Lewis Fernandez. He's mark began a W R triangle in 20 up another episode uh on Monday uh at five PM. You can listen to it wherever you get your podcasts or watch it on the 99 9, the fan youtube page. Uh Thank you so much for watching y'all talk to you later. Bye.