Welcome to the very first Wrl Triangle into podcast. I'm your host, Mark Bergen, joined by my guy Luis Fernandez Luis. This is a reunion of sorts. We're talking, it's National Oreo Cookie Day. This analogy is going to be lost about a year from now. I couldn't find any lemon Oreo cookies at my local Harris teeter, but recording this right on the eve of the A C C tournament, Lewis. How are you this afternoon? My man, I am doing great, Mark. You know, it's funny they were actually about six boxes of lemon Oreo cookies in the media section at the Dean Smith Center on Saturday. I don't know who brought them. I definitely snuck a couple. They were solid. Uh It just tasted like any kind of lemon dessert. I get it. It's not my, it would not be my favorite cookie, but I understand the hype Louis. Let's get right into it. Duke Unc Duke sweeps the season series in the 2020 to 23 season. I'm just gonna say this right off the top. It didn't have the fanfare didn't have the luster of what this rivalry has had in previous seasons. Let alone last season you had Coach K's final season. You have multiple first round picks for Duke. Chiefly Paolo Bank Arrow. Neither of these teams are ranked but like it was hard for me to muster the same amount of enthusiasm that I had last season compared to this year. What say you? Well, I mean, yes, I think to an extent it's, it's gonna be hard to kind of top the level of enthusiasm surrounding those three matchups. I mean, how many times are you and see and do gonna meet in the final four? I don't know, probably, hopefully never again. Um Personally, I kind of one of those situations that give you heart palpitations. Hold on. I just had a team's notification pop up and close this window. All good Louis and I'll say this too last year. You had Caleb Love hitting the big jumper over Mark Williams in New orleans' and U N C knocking out Duke in the final four. So it wasn't just K but like if you're a U N C fan, you take last season over this season nine times out of 10. But now the question to me leads Lewis is who's gonna be coming back because short of winning the A C C tournament, we'll get to that a little bit. I can't help but wonder is Armando Bacot back, Caleb love RJ Davis, they have the option to come back to Chapel Hill if they so choose. But at a certain point, like the N I L deal, money is great and everything and that's opened up a lot of opportunity for a lot of other college athletes. But at certain points, just like if your NBA ready, you got to be able to go UNC starts this season, preseason number one. And now right now, like Louis short of winning the A C C tournament, they're gonna be on the outside looking in and it's like we might be thinking we're talking N I T with the tar heels. You have said that the start of the season, I mean, use whatever adjective you want to. It's crazy. Absolutely. Out of your mind. It, I just can't believe it. Louis, the field expanded to 64 teams in 1984 and the preseason number one has never missed that. I mean, that just says it all right there. I mean, what, what comes next, it's gonna be big picture, um, kind of difficult to determine Armando Bacot can technically come back. He said on Wednesday that are achieving on Thursday that he wasn't really sure what he was going to do yet is something he's gonna think about once the season is over right now, the way things are set up, the U N C can't lose another game for the remainder of college basketball. The next game they lose, in my opinion will be the last game they play. Um, so they just gotta roll with it and see what happens. RJ Davis, I think will come back. Caleb loves. That's a big question mark. Uh It's gonna be really interesting. It would not surprise me if this roster looks a lot different, um, transfers all of that going to be something very interesting to watch. Come this offseason Louis, here's where I'm at, I think has gone to the league. Love, I think is a bit of a coin flip. I think he ultimately goes, I'm with you there. I think Davis returns for another season, but I look at this and it's like four of your five starters are back which everyone knows the average age of this tar heels team. The starting line up 22.4 years old. Bay Kat was the overwhelming favorite of the, is the A C C preseason player of the year. He's like a double, double machine and, and it's just like how in the heck is this team that started out preseason? Number one didn't expect them to keep the top spot all season long, but they're one and nine against quadrant one games there too and 10 against teams currently projected to reach the field of 68. The sun doesn't equal its parts with this tar heels team Lewis and I'm sorry to add salt to the wound because I know you are a UNC grad. I am. Yeah. No, thank you. I appreciate the salt. Um No, I think it's, it's so tough because last year you look at the run that they made and it was so much of making the right place at the right times in those critical moments and they just haven't been able to do that this year. You can just go back game after game after game, Duke twice. Syracuse Alabama Iowa State like it's, it feels like almost every single game that was important to them. There was just a fumbling of it towards the end and you have to be able to shoot the ball as well. I mean, shooting the percentages that they have from three, that, that is not going to do it for you in this, this modern N B A. It makes you really or modern college basketball. It makes you really easy to defend. People know you get the double team Armando Bacot, uh kind of push the ball on the outside sag off of some of these three point shooters that aren't as consistent And kind of live and die with those outside shots. And it's just, you know, it really is, it's more complicated than that, but not being able to make open shots is one of the big reasons why unc is in this position right now. It was evident on Saturday Lewis shooting just a tick above 30% from the floor. And it's just like if you can't they always say the N B A it's a make or Miss League, but that was the story on Saturday. Now A C C tournament getting underway and the triangle teams U N C will play the winner of Boston College Louisville on Wednesday night. Following that game N C State's going to take on the winner of Virginia Tech in Notre Dame Duke has by until the quarterfinals on Thursday nights. So Louis, the question begs is which of the triangle teams is going to make it the furthest I think really, we have two choices here. I want to hear what you say and I can make the case for the other one. But go ahead. I mean, double byes, I think, go a very long way in helping us special in these type of tournaments. That's why you play the regular season. That's why you get these wins to be in that top four spot in the conference. So I think it's, it's gotta be Duke that has the potential to go the farthest when, when you look at their matchups, they did lose to Miami who could be a team that they would play if they were to win that first game. So, you know, it'll be interesting, but I do think semifinals kind of feels like the floor for this Duke team. They just, they don't really have any of these guys that are gonna absolutely blow you away. I mean, Derek Lively is incredibly talented from a defensive perspective. Jeremy Roach has been that veteran leader, uh Kyle Filipowski the heat, barbecue chicken is all I got to say with some of the moves he was making on the low post. It was, it was crazy, but I think that they just have the lowest or the highest floor I should say. I think semifinals is the, you know, easy, easy to see Duke getting. At least they're in this tournament. I'm with you, with Duke in the sense that lively and Filipowski can kind of do like the twin towers type thing and create matchup problems for opposing teams solely with their length. Now, Philip in the offensive and lively on the defensive end and I'm gonna say this and this is no knock on like, I'm reluctant to do this, but Derek lively his impact defensively when he's got it going. It's like Anthony Davis light, like very, very light, very, very light, but that's what it reminds me of, of the kind of impact he can have protecting the rim blocking shots, getting rebounds and getting your offense set up just the defensive impact that he makes. Yeah, I think that's very, it's, he was the, depending on how much you like. Plus minus. He led both teams and plus minus in the game against, uh against U N C on Saturday. It's just, it's, it's what he is, he, it makes it very, very hard. There were in protection even when, even when lively had the four fouls and was taken out like the 17 minute mark in the second half, he, the Duke's defense adjusted and you gotta credit Jon Scheyer for what he's been able to do with this team. And you know, I just, like I said, low or high, high floor is what this feels like for this Duke A C C tournament run. Let me make the case for the Wolfpack Lewis, the guard play and we get obsessed over this in March and Smith Dark L Joyner man, those guys when they have it right. You can see why both of those players have NBA futures. I would be shocked if they're still at Raleigh a year from now. Either player. I think both of them. I think that highly of both Smith is really the only one who has the option of coming back, but they've been very excited. And then how about some love for the big fellow Mike I D J O and he transferred from Tennessee Lewis many moons ago. We worked together in Knoxville, bounce, bounced around a little bit. But when they get the ball to the big fella offensively, he knows how to throw his weight around cause problems. If you're not going to double him, he knows how to use his body to score down low, create matchup problems. If I'm an imposing team, I put him in a screen and roll and make him defend perimeter players, make him defend wings, make him to defend guards in a pick and roll switch situation, but offensively he causes problems to where if you don't double him, he causes, he can score, you can score consistently. But then those two guards, that's the case I'd make for the wolfpack. I think they go as far as dark hell joiner and dark wavy in Smith can carry them because when they have it right there as good as any tandem, I would argue in all of college basketball. But again, it's, it's funny because several weeks ago Lewis, it was looking like N C state of all the triangle teams were Belle of the ball. They sputtered. They've lost two in a row. Three of their last five. Duke is now kind of the belle of the ball in U N C who would win three in a row. They slip up in the Battle of the Blues. So it's, it's almost like uh a musical chair situation, Louis. That's what I'll say. No, I think that's fair. And I think Jon Karl Joyner and Smith are so much fun to watch D J Burns is fantastic. My thing at this point is, you know, they're gonna have to play Clemson. Should they win that first game? Which I think they should, they play the winner of Notre Dame and Virginia Attack. I don't think that should be an issue for them. Um But, you know, Clemson, what's that matchup gonna look like? They just lost to Clemson a few weeks back. Uh Clemson plays well. It'll be interesting to see how that one goes, but I could, I could definitely see them getting to the semi finals and U N C. We haven't even brought them up in this conversation because I, they, they have to play, uh, most likely a Hot Boston college team. If, if Quentin Post is healthy, I know he, he twisted his ankle or sprained his ankle against Georgia Tech this weekend. But if he's healthy, he's a matchup nightmare and he's gonna be really tough for them to play. And then if they, if they beat Boston college, congratulations, Virginia. And I know, I know I know that UNC just beat Virginia, but they're going to have to have another really great shooting night and this team is just so inconsistent shooting outside. It's hard to see them getting much further past Thursday loose. You had that great stat earlier about U N C. I've got another one for you, Duke and UNC unranked during Saturday's Battle of the Blues matchup. They were unranked as well when they played in February on February the fourth, the last two times, the two teams were unranked. February 6 2021. But then before that, you gotta go all the way back to 1960. So it's weird not to have one of the two schools in the top 25 little in the caliber of recruits that they consistently bring in. There's a reason where that, why they're blue bloods consistently. It's just been a strange season really for, for both teams, for both Duke and UNC, I don't know what to expect because you could tell me that U N C could go on a run a lot like they did last year. I wouldn't be surprised if the likelihood of that happening. I just don't see it. I just don't see it. No, they just, whatever reason it might be, they just don't have it. They didn't have it this year and that's it is what it is. We'll see what ends up happening. Um, you know, come to sec tournament and anything can happen. But they're, like I said, I think the next time that they lose a game, it will be their last game of the season really quickly favorite before the A C C tournament. And we'll go to the NFL combine, Louis. I will take Virginia. It's the safe pick. They play at a slow methodical pace, but they've got like, three guys that are double digit scores are high scores, like 12 points a game, Lewis. I'm gonna take Virginia. It's a very safe pick to win the SEC tournament. What do you think? Give me, I think it's gonna come from the top part of the bracket. Okay. I'm gonna take pit just because I think it's different. It would be fun. Um, I think they've, they've shown that they compete with all these top teams. I also think it be just, just picking Miami would be a little bit too like chalk. So I'm gonna go with Pit. Let's, let's see what the Panthers can do. All right, Lewis NFL combine is wrapping up. The Panthers have the ninth pick a lot of standouts this weekend and we found out today breaking news here on WRL Triangle into Derek Carr is going to go to the Saints. So that eliminates one quarterback option. That car was the Panthers were one of the favorites to sign Derek Carr. What do the Panthers do now at quarterback number nine, Anthony Richardson, his stock, the Florida quarterback is rising very, very quickly after this weekend. What do you think happens? What do the Panthers do at number nine? What happens at the quarterback position? Walk us through after what's been an exciting weekend with the NFL combine? The NFL combine is always so much fun because like, you know, it's, it's how, how well do these players move in shorts versus in pads? And I don't know, it's just, it's one of those things where I think there's a lot to learn from it, but you need to be careful how much stock you put into it. Um, so when you look at it, it's they, I think they're going to take that first round pick and use, use it on a quarterback. Um, just with how everything's shaking out in free agency, it doesn't really seem likely that they're going to go with that free agent route. If they did, it would be someone like a Derek Carr who, by the way, as someone who has Chris Olave in a fantasy football keepers league, very excited that he's, he's heading to New Orleans. Uh, but I think that, you know, it's the question is which, which quarterback is going to be left? C J Stroud Bryce Young will love us. Anthony Richardson. Those four to me are the possible option there at nine and I don't know if one of them is going to be there at nine, which means they would have to trade up for that looking into a little bit ever since Scott Fitterer came into the picture in 2021 they have been acted active in trading picks. You know, you look at the, The Dan Arnold, the Sam Donald, obviously those kind of ones that happened outside of the draft, but they've also been active in terms of trading actual draft picks during the draft. The one thing you really haven't seen for the Panthers as an organization is trading up those top end first round picks. So in order to get one of these guys, I think they're gonna have to do something that they've never done before, which is trade higher up into higher up in that top 10. I mean, I think Bryce Young is probably gonna be the first guy off the board, but Anthony Richardson is, he's so interesting from an athletic perspective. I tried to tell myself not to follow for the Anthony Richardson hype because, you know, he wasn't exactly great at Florida. He, he has some accuracy issues, some ball placement issues, but my goodness, his athleticism jumps off the charts. He has great vision, his pocket presence, he has that kind of all of these tools. The foundation is there. You just need someone to coach him up a little bit from the accuracy and ball placement perspective. And you know, that's, that's kind of part of the reason why you hire Frank Reich in the first place is to coach someone up. Will he be there though? I don't know, Louis, I think you hit the nail on the head. I don't think any of the four quarterbacks you named are gonna be there at nine. So you're going to have to trade up point blank period like the premium at the quarterback position in the NFL. You really, you hamstring your ability to win if you don't have a blue chip guy. Now, a player like Anthony Richardson, the coaching fit and the personnel around him, I think, and you can say this about any rookie, but for him particularly, there is no ceiling, but there might not be a floor either. Some of the other quarterbacks, I think you kind of have a better idea of what you're going to get. Now, a lot of people are going to make a big deal about the size of Bryce Young and it is a big deal Lewis because similar size, height and weight, uh, to Kyler Murray and you know, Kyler Murray Russell Wilson Drew Brees are the names that get thrown out there. A lot of quarterbacks, six ft and under, but those are really the exception, not the rule at the quarterback position. The Panthers have to get someone because I go back to okay in the post Cam Newton era and I'm not talking about his second stint, but you bring in Teddy Bridgewater, it doesn't work then. No, no, no, no. We're gonna bring in Sam Donald that doesn't work. Baker Mayfield, we can get Cleveland to pay his salary and we can get maybe a diamond in the rough for 50 cents on the dollar. But the reality of the situation Lewis is, is the way that the Panthers handled the quarterback situation a year ago. They, they allocated the 10th highest amount of money in the NFL to the quarterback position last season. They didn't have the 10th best quarterback play in the league. So you bring in Baker Mayfield for a one year rental, really half season rental. And it's like, oh, this is a savvy move, but it's because you haven't been able to find the guy post Cam Newton. How are you gonna be able to do that moving forward and trying to sign one of these veterans maybe as a stopgap for the young rookie young quarterback that you seek to develop, but I just don't see it right now and look the two quarterbacks under contract right now. Matt Corral Jacob Eason. I really don't think that they're the answers either. So you've got to go to the draft, you're likely going to have to trade up, like you said, Lewis. Yeah, not my question to you. Mark is, let's say let's go and eliminate maybe Bryce Young from the equation. I do think he's gonna be top three. Uh, which quarterback do you feel like would be the best fit for the Panthers? Be the guy. The Panthers should, if you know, if everything turns out great, this is the guy who falls in their lap. Levis. Honestly, if you get Levis, I think you're over the moon. I think you're ecstatic because yes, CJ Stroud, like they all looked impressive this last weekend, the ones that worked out at the combine, the ones that through with the combine, Levis is almost like when Justin Herbert was coming in the league and no one knew anything about him really coming in. And then once they saw him play in the ability, his ability to make throws. I think someone's gonna fall in love with Richardson, but again, I think fit is probably most important for Richard where Richardson, whereas like other great quarterbacks are able to make it work regardless of what system scheme coach they're able to go to Richardson I think the fit is probably the most important for his success. Young, I would say the same thing too because young so undersized if he has a bad offensive line in front of him, if he doesn't have the weight to be able to protect himself. So I think if the Panthers could wind up, at least with one of these guys, they wound up with Levis though, that would really, really excite me. Not this, not the sexier, the flashy pick Louis, but it's, it's about what are you gonna be able to do to get yourself back in a situation where you're not just continue to win? What's been a weaker division this past season in the NFC South, what can you do to get yourself as a contender again? You gotta have the quarterback and the Panthers point blank period have not had that now for several seasons. I think it'll be, we're going to find out a lot about what the Panthers future will look like based on this quarterback pick because I think someone like Levis, someone like Richardson, he's gonna need a little more time to develop. Levis has a lot of potential. He even said himself, he was excited to get out there and throw because he had a cannon. Um But you know, there was some inconsistency, some turnover issues. Uh Kentucky in the SEC plays a lot of really good defenses but, but still Richardson, you see the potential fly through the ceiling but there were some easy, obvious plays that are missed because of some accuracy and ball placement. Things to me though. If they get C J C J Stroud falls to the Panthers in my mind, then the Panthers create a situation where he could be offensive rookie of the year. They could have a very quick turnaround because I think he is the most ready to start and play immediately. I think, I don't know, I don't think he's gonna fall that far. They would have to trade up to get him C J Stroud to me of that group. If I'm the Panthers, I, I'm intrigued. Absolutely. And you look at like Richardson like, what highest vertical ever. And it's like, okay, when is a quarterback ever jumping that high? But at 240 plus pounds and he's running +444, 40 Louis, it's just like good luck catching him when he's in the open field in when an offensive coordinator is smart and he's able to design plays, enforce an opposing defense to play 11 on 11. That's what's required in the modern NFL. So it's not to say, okay, do you need a Lamar Jackson or Michael Vick style quarterback? That's not what I'm talking about, but it's about holding defenses accountable go late in the Super Bowl this past season, Patrick Mahomes scramble like 30 or 40 yards down the field that helped the Chief's seal and win the game. So you've got to be able to do that as a quarterback in the 21st century as a quarterback in this league, Lewis. And I got to throw another rhetorical out here. We're gonna go away from the quarterback position really quickly. If Jalen Carter is there at number nine, it's a question you're gonna have to ask. Yeah, I mean, his talent is through the roof. I mean, you see the way that he played that, you know, in Georgia, when you're watching some of these guys like the Will Levis tape and things like that, he's constantly jumping out. Obviously, the everything that's going on with the legal stuff that has to get sorted out and I'm sure these teams will do their due diligence. Um I, I think it's an interesting rhetorical question but even with the legal stuff going on, I don't think that teams are going to let him slip. I don't think he's gonna be there. Um You know, because this is the guy who like, you know, if the, if the Bears end up keeping that pick instead of trading it, he's probably gonna be their guy or at least he was before everything that that happened over this past week with the news of his potential involvement with the tragic crash that happened in, in Georgia earlier this year. So, I it's gonna be really interesting. Um But ultimately, it's gonna be hard for me to see the Panthers picking someone that is not a quarterback unless of course they're all gone. And then, well, good luck. I know a lot of fans are with you there, Louis. Now, as far as Jalen Carter goes, he's doing court on April the 18th, first round of the draft. April the 27th in Kansas City. We'll see how all that plays out. Not always popular. Say, hey, let's wait and see. Let's wait and see and see how that process plays itself out. See, I do think he will fall though Lewis. I do think he will fall to where before I think he was in that conversation. Top three picks. How far he falls though? That's, that's what we're gonna remain to see any other observations from the combine that I'm missing Lewis before we wrap up here. I just, I keep in mind if you're, you know, Panthers fans listening, just make sure you're paying attention to the production of the players that are going to be drafted as well as their athletic ability and their age. You gotta, you gotta hit that, you know, that athletic ability and that the younger they are, You need to have that potential. It's hard getting a, being a 25 year old, 24 year old senior coming out here and trying to have a successful athletic career in the NFL. That's, that's just kind of how I view it. Um once again, combine, numbers are important but view them as part of the whole, not as everything wise words there, Louis. I am totally with you there. I think I want to thank everyone for tuning in, watching and listening. It's our very first WRL triangle and two. We're gonna be out each Monday at five o'clock on the 99 9 fan youtube page and Louis. This is a lot of fun tap that subscribe button and whatever podcast platform, tap, subscribe. Leave us a review. Let us know what questions you have, you have feedback for us. Leave us a five star review. But Lewis has been a lot of fun. Absolutely. Mark can't wait to see what else we can cook up here over the next few months as the sports world really ramps up for Luis Fernandez. I'm Mark Bergen. Thanks for watching Wrl Triangle and Two. We'll see you next time until then take care and so long everybody.