Greatest coach - Dean Smith or Mike Krzyzewski?
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heelman73 Mar 29, 2010
Sports Legend
What the genius did after the shot clock was implemented was continue to kick the s*%t out of the same teams he kicked the s*%t out of before there was a clock.
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mgkkelly1983 Mar 29, 2010
Veteran
My husband made a great observation. To be a successful coach isn't just about winning games. It is about motivating your players to play above and beyond their level. He thinks that coach K does a better job at this than Dean. But he brought up a good point by saying that Jimmy V took a good team and turned it into a great, championship team that had more heart than any team I have ever seen. Even though I am a huge Duke fan, I must agree with this statement completely. It is a shame that we will never see all that he could have accomplished at NCSU.
As for me, I watched Duke lose for many, many years . People forget that sometimes. Coach K has brought Duke to a level that is equal to anything Dean did at UNC.
— Posted by tomdebpObviously, you are way too young to remember Dean Smith and all his great accomplishments!! He truly is the better and greatest coach of all times!! Even better than your beloved buck teeth Koach K!! Dean also coached in an era when only one team from the ACC went to the NCAA's and to go, you had to win the ACC tourney!! alot tougher then than it is now to get in. You and your wimpy husband are obviously Dook fans to make an observation like that!! You guys couldn't be more wrong!! So again, its Dean E. Smith, the greatest of all time!! Yay girlfriends!!!
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mgkkelly1983 Mar 29, 2010
Veteran
It's called making a point, Kenny. If it's a 2-0 lead, or a 25-20 lead, it doesn't change the point that he would hold the ball an inordinate amount of time JUST BECAUSE the rules would let him.
Like I said, basketball the way God intended it.
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02
Once again, UNC's scoring averages refute your assertion. Don't let the facts change it though.
— Posted by kennywalters
There is no statistic you can present that will refute that Carolina simply held the ball for inordinate periods of time to help them win games.
If only we could go back in time and install a shot clock and see what the genius would do then. But we already know. It would force Carolina to actually PLAY the game of basketball.
I'm gone.
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02
What the genius did after the shot clock was implemented was continue to kick the s*%t out of the same teams he kicked the s*%t out of before there was a clock.
— Posted by heelman73Of course some of you are too young to remember, but Dean was on the NCAA committee and he was one of the people who actually voted to install the shot clock. The 4 corners tactics won us some games and costed us some too!! So, it's actually all good!! yay girlfriends!!
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mgkkelly1983 Mar 29, 2010
Veteran
In 2009, d00k won the acc championship but its a known fact that the best team in the ACC, and the country for that matter, was UNC. I wonder how many other times the "Real" ACC champion fizzled out in the NCAA's while the regular season winner went on to a more productive post season?
— Posted by BeastOnTheHill
And Carolina gets credit for what they did in 2009.
But they still didn't win the conference championship in 2009. For whatever reason. They had an injury. What other teams also had injuries that prevented more win totals in 2009? Carolina went on to win the national championship. They only get credit for what they did. Duke was the best team in 1999, too. UConn was not the better team, but on that one night, they played better and won the national championship. Are you willing to credit Duke with something for that? Didn't think so. Duke was practically an NBA team that year, until the refs gave the game to UConn.
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02
last I checked UCONN does not play in the ACC. sorry but your point is off. try reading comprehension classes.
and just like you, and a state fan, to cry about the ref's. D00k got beat, pure and simple.
I still believe you're a d00k boy wannabe but just trapped by a wolves sheepskin.
— Posted by BeastOnTheHill
I'm sorry, did I say Duke lost to UConn in an ACC championship game? Maybe you'd care to point that out.
Someone was trying to give Carolina credit for being the BEST team, even though they lost the ACC championship last year. Well, Duke was the BEST team in 1999, too. But I don't see you lining up to give them any credit for that since they also blew the championship.
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02Don't forget girls, UNC did lose the ACC championship last year and lost without their main guy, Ty Lawson, who was sitting out the tourney with a broken big toe! It actaully paid off because he went in the NCAA's like a ball of fire and led the Heels to a NCAA Championship!! yay girlfriends!! xoxo
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Tizu Mar 29, 2010
Sports Legend
Oh, God...the fruitcake is back.
***Disclaimer*** I have nothing against homosexuals, and I apologize if I've offended someone...but a 50 year old man blowing kisses and ending every post with "yay girlfriends!! xoxo" has serious gay issues. Come out already and quit being so gay...you are making the gay community look bad! -
mgkkelly1983 Mar 29, 2010
Veteran
Oh, God...the fruitcake is back.
***Disclaimer*** I have nothing against homosexuals, and I apologize if I've offended someone...but a 50 year old man blowing kisses and ending every post with "yay girlfriends!! xoxo" has serious gay issues. Come out already and quit being so gay...you are making the gay community look bad!
— Posted by TizuWhat makes you think that I am a man? I am a woman named Michelle!! I am not gay, or lez!! A woman who happens to be a sports fan like you knucklehead men(girlies)!! yay girlfriends!! xoxo
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Dreamchaser Mar 29, 2010
Sports Legend
Oh, God...the fruitcake is back.
***Disclaimer*** I have nothing against homosexuals, and I apologize if I've offended someone...but a 50 year old man blowing kisses and ending every post with "yay girlfriends!! xoxo" has serious gay issues. Come out already and quit being so gay...you are making the gay community look bad!
— Posted by TizuI agree
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Tizu Mar 29, 2010
Sports Legend
What makes you think that I am a man? I am a woman named Michelle!! I am not gay, or lez!! A woman who happens to be a sports fan like you knucklehead men(girlies)!! yay girlfriends!! xoxoOh, God...the fruitcake is back.
***Disclaimer*** I have nothing against homosexuals, and I apologize if I've offended someone...but a 50 year old man blowing kisses and ending every post with "yay girlfriends!! xoxo" has serious gay issues. Come out already and quit being so gay...you are making the gay community look bad!
— Posted by Tizu
— Posted by mgkkelly1983Man or woman, you're still a fruitcake! LOL
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melmika Mar 29, 2010
Bench Warmer
In respect to Dean Smith and Coach K, it doesn't really matters who is THE greatest coach When they enter the playing area, everyone knows that they are going to be treated to an orchestra of players performing the Mozart of basketball for all to see being led by the greatest conductors of our time. Enjoy it while it last.
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originalTarheel1 Mar 29, 2010
Towel Boy
MD Mangum
Stop dragging my family name through the mud. My Dad from Durham went to UNC after the war because the VA did not pay for all of private school Dook. After nam I went to UNC for the same reasons. Both are great schools, both have had great basketball coaches. Both have real students and and real aholes. However, there is a difference between the attitude of a public and expensive private school graduate. UNC is THE University of NC, Dook is a fine private school in NC.
As for Dean and the rat-one is a gentleman and the other is a coach who can't stop his mouth from running even when he is on top. -
Dreamchaser Mar 29, 2010
Sports Legend
What makes you think that I am a man? I am a woman named Michelle!! I am not gay, or lez!! A woman who happens to be a sports fan like you knucklehead men(girlies)!! yay girlfriends!! xoxoOh, God...the fruitcake is back.
***Disclaimer*** I have nothing against homosexuals, and I apologize if I've offended someone...but a 50 year old man blowing kisses and ending every post with "yay girlfriends!! xoxo" has serious gay issues. Come out already and quit being so gay...you are making the gay community look bad!
— Posted by Tizu
— Posted by mgkkelly1983
Man or woman, you're still a fruitcake! LOL
— Posted by TizuI hate to say it, but you can pick friends, but you can't pick family, or people that root for your team.
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mgkkelly1983 Mar 29, 2010
Veteran
What makes you think that I am a man? I am a woman named Michelle!! I am not gay, or lez!! A woman who happens to be a sports fan like you knucklehead men(girlies)!! yay girlfriends!! xoxoOh, God...the fruitcake is back.
***Disclaimer*** I have nothing against homosexuals, and I apologize if I've offended someone...but a 50 year old man blowing kisses and ending every post with "yay girlfriends!! xoxo" has serious gay issues. Come out already and quit being so gay...you are making the gay community look bad!
— Posted by Tizu
— Posted by mgkkelly1983
Man or woman, you're still a fruitcake! LOL
— Posted by TizuYou are a fruitcake and so is your mama and kids!! yay girlfriend!! xoxo
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Tizu Mar 29, 2010
Sports Legend
You are a fruitcake and so is your mama and kids!! yay girlfriend!! xoxoWhat makes you think that I am a man? I am a woman named Michelle!! I am not gay, or lez!! A woman who happens to be a sports fan like you knucklehead men(girlies)!! yay girlfriends!! xoxoOh, God...the fruitcake is back.
***Disclaimer*** I have nothing against homosexuals, and I apologize if I've offended someone...but a 50 year old man blowing kisses and ending every post with "yay girlfriends!! xoxo" has serious gay issues. Come out already and quit being so gay...you are making the gay community look bad!
— Posted by Tizu
— Posted by mgkkelly1983
Man or woman, you're still a fruitcake! LOL
— Posted by Tizu
— Posted by mgkkelly1983that was so funny I forgot to laugh.
FAIL! -
4tarheels Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
But here's why it shouldn't be used in determining who is the greatest coach:
1) Unbalanced scheduling (no more round-robin) can result in more difficult league scheduling. Conversely, it could result in an EASIER schedule. But until the league plays a round-robin schedule, winning the faux-championship is meaningless. Imagine if VT had finished as a #1 seed. They played all the worst ACC teams twice this year. They had an easier run to the faux-championship.
2) Counting total conference wins and counting faux-championships is just a way of counting conference wins twice.
3) It's not a league championship. It's just a fun thing for the fans to crow about. The league doesn't issue you a trophy for it. They mention it in the media guide the following year.
Count total wins. Count conference wins. Count conference championships (the REAL ones). Count national championships. If you like, count championship game losses (runner-ups). But the faux-championship just adds more weight to something you're already counting -- league wins.
Based on meaningful numbers, Coach K has surpassed Dean in just about every category. And if he hasn't, he's either close, or most likely WILL surpass it soon (whatever there is left).
Oh yeah, Dean came up with the Four Corners, too. That was a real contribution to college basketball, wasn't it! LOL
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02TBK...You are usually good about quoting facts but not this time, maybe because you're wanting to cherry pick your facts. K has won one more national title, but other than that Dean leads in every other category. Winning percentage overall, conference games winning percentage, conference titles, head to head, final four appearances are now tied. K and Dean are both legends.
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tommybrownnc Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
This topic is like asking who likes Duke's mayonnaise or Miracle Whip better? Every one has a reason to their opinion and in the end, who gives a hoot? I didn't like Dean because he won too much! I like K because he started beating Carolina more often than any other Duke coach could. They are both legends. They made their schools proud and respected in the nation. But, jeez, it's not like they found a cure for cancer. They just coached/coach a sports team. In the overall scheme of things, what's the big, E**ing deal??? :)
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kennywalters Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
Your exact words were "make a basket and hold the ball for the last 39 1/2 minutes". That implies that UNC purposely held scoring down to win games. I've gone over this before with another blind ABC fan who refused to let facts sway them. I pulled up the scores from the pre-shot clock era under Dean and there were like 3 games where a strategy of slowing the game down for an extended period may have been employed. As previously pointed out on this thread, UNC averaged enough points that the "stall" couldn't have been a major game-long strategy under Dean yet you continue to harp on it as being such. Faced with statistical evidence that completely refutes your claim, you just yell louder hoping to sway people to think the same. You remind me of a lot of our politicians today. Don't let the facts get in the way.
— Posted by kennywalters
It's called making a point, Kenny. If it's a 2-0 lead, or a 25-20 lead, it doesn't change the point that he would hold the ball an inordinate amount of time JUST BECAUSE the rules would let him.
Like I said, basketball the way God intended it.
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02
Once again, UNC's scoring averages refute your assertion. Don't let the facts change it though.
— Posted by kennywalters
There is no statistic you can present that will refute that Carolina simply held the ball for inordinate periods of time to help them win games.
If only we could go back in time and install a shot clock and see what the genius would do then. But we already know. It would force Carolina to actually PLAY the game of basketball.
I'm gone.
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02Hmmm, so, a shot clock is the way the game was meant to be played? Somehow, I don't think James Naismith imagined a shot clock, a 3 point line, alternating possession rules, etc. So seriously, if you're going to harp on the way the game was intended to be played, then you should advocate a return to peach baskets and a jump ball after every score.
And now, 39 1/2 minutes has changed to an "inordinate" amount of time. So, what is inordinate? Two minutes? 5 minutes? I mean was Coach Smith's responsibility to play the game the way you thought it should be played, or was it his responsibility to try and win those games by whatever means the rules would allow? Personally, I think the latter. -
amitster Mar 30, 2010
Towel Boy
This is a silly question since both coaches are stellar. There can be no head to head comparison since there are so many factors that need to be taken into account.
People who are bandying about raw statistics to make a case for coach K seem to omit the most obvious stat. Their record against each other. Coach Smith clearly beats K hands down on that one. The other vital stat would be graduation rate of their players. I do not know the numbers there but remember UNC being ranked #1 by TIME in that category. Lastly, SI ran a story many years ago where they attributed seven unique BB innovations to Coach Smith (e.g., huddle, four corners, etc.). Again, not sure if Coach K can claim any original contribution to the game as his own.
If someone really insists that these guys be ranked, in my view Dean Smith would have an edge over Mike K. In fact, I believe with the exception of John Wooden, no coach could be considered as great as Coach Smith. -
grant Mar 30, 2010
Bench Warmer
Look back at the history. Alot of you Duke fans are so vapid. You haven't had the intrest in Dean or UNC to know what Dean built at UNC and where they were at when he first started coaching there. The history with bringing in the first black players, the relationship between coach and players that prepared individuals not only for basketball but for rewarding and enriching lives. One of these coaches was ground breaking and changed the way the game was played. The other learned from his genius on the court, slowly bringing a school that was once a basketball great SLOWLY back from nowhere. There is no comparison between the teacher and the student. Anyone will catch up given enough yrs. and chances. Few do it amoung the first and different than anyone before.
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jrj6950 Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
We should all just be proud that we have 2 of the most accomplished and respected college coaches of all time that are either still coaching or coached our favorite teams. There is no way to prove Coach A is better than Coach B, I mean looking at the numbers certainly can strengthen ones case for who is better. But all in all, it is just an opinionated question. They are both great basketball coaches and hall of famers. Lets just leave it at that.
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Dreamchaser Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
We should all just be proud that we have 2 of the most accomplished and respected college coaches of all time that are either still coaching or coached our favorite teams. There is no way to prove Coach A is better than Coach B, I mean looking at the numbers certainly can strengthen ones case for who is better. But all in all, it is just an opinionated question. They are both great basketball coaches and hall of famers. Lets just leave it at that.
— Posted by jrj6950Very good post and you are exactly right.
( I still think Dean has the edge though LOL ) -
4tarheels Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
We should all just be proud that we have 2 of the most accomplished and respected college coaches of all time that are either still coaching or coached our favorite teams. There is no way to prove Coach A is better than Coach B, I mean looking at the numbers certainly can strengthen ones case for who is better. But all in all, it is just an opinionated question. They are both great basketball coaches and hall of famers. Lets just leave it at that.
— Posted by jrj6950I mostly agree with that as well. I have tried to discuss facts and statistics which are objective, but Duke fans and ABC fans want to cherry pick the stats rather than look at the whole picture.
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4tarheels Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
Those numbers are accurate but you conveniently leave out others which tell a more complete picture.
Dean winning %: 77.58% (879-254)
K winning %: 75.6% (866-279)
Saying K has only coached 35 years versus Dean's 36 years is misleading because K has already coached 12 MORE games than Dean. Will K win more games than Dean did, sure because he will have coached a lot more games than Dean. K will also lose more games than Dean did.
You also leave out ACC tournament championships:
Dean=12
K = 11
Again, we both know they are both great legends in college basketball, but don't pretend you deal in facts and UNC fans don't when you conveniently leave out the stats you don't like. -
BeastOnTheHill Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
"K will also lose more games than Dean did." He already has passed Dean in this catagory about 5 years ago.
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scmae36 Mar 30, 2010
Towel Boy
Those numbers are accurate but you conveniently leave out others which tell a more complete picture.
Dean winning %: 77.58% (879-254)
K winning %: 75.6% (866-279)
Saying K has only coached 35 years versus Dean's 36 years is misleading because K has already coached 12 MORE games than Dean. Will K win more games than Dean did, sure because he will have coached a lot more games than Dean. K will also lose more games than Dean did.
You also leave out ACC tournament championships:
Dean=12
K = 11
Again, we both know they are both great legends in college basketball, but don't pretend you deal in facts and UNC fans don't when you conveniently leave out the stats you don't like.
— Posted by 4tarheelsthe ultimate goal is NC's...period....and who has more?....and he might get # 4 this yr...which would give him as many as deano AND roy
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kennywalters Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
the ultimate goal is NC's...period....and who has more?....and he might get # 4 this yr...which would give him as many as deano AND royThose numbers are accurate but you conveniently leave out others which tell a more complete picture.
Dean winning %: 77.58% (879-254)
K winning %: 75.6% (866-279)
Saying K has only coached 35 years versus Dean's 36 years is misleading because K has already coached 12 MORE games than Dean. Will K win more games than Dean did, sure because he will have coached a lot more games than Dean. K will also lose more games than Dean did.
You also leave out ACC tournament championships:
Dean=12
K = 11
Again, we both know they are both great legends in college basketball, but don't pretend you deal in facts and UNC fans don't when you conveniently leave out the stats you don't like.
— Posted by 4tarheels
— Posted by scmae36So, K has been a failure in 31 seasons because he didn't win a national championship and only a success in 3 so far, maybe a 4th this year? I'm sure K would treat you like a writer for the Chronicle if you told him that.
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scmae36 Mar 30, 2010
Towel Boy
uhhhh/you arrived at this logic, how?..
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kennywalters Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
uhhhh/you arrived at this logic, how?..
— Posted by scmae36Because if the ultimate goal is to win National Championships...period....
then anything less than that is a failure. If you don't win the national championship, then you have fallen short. -
TruthBKnown Banned Again02 Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
Personally I think TBK does't protest to much. Did someone say obsessed?
— Posted by Dreamchaser
It does seem that this got to him, doesn't it? :)
— Posted by tommybrownncIt probably seems that way. I just don't like to let weasely Carolina fans try to think Dean was better than K. It's so much fun hitting that sore spot with them!
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heelman73 Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
Personally I think TBK does't protest to much. Did someone say obsessed?
— Posted by Dreamchaser
It does seem that this got to him, doesn't it? :)
— Posted by tommybrownnc
It probably seems that way. I just don't like to let weasely Carolina fans try to think Dean was better than K. It's so much fun hitting that sore spot with them!
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02It's not just the "weasely" fans. We all think Dean was better. Nothing will ever change that.
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Dreamchaser Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
Personally I think TBK does't protest to much. Did someone say obsessed?
— Posted by Dreamchaser
It does seem that this got to him, doesn't it? :)
— Posted by tommybrownnc
It probably seems that way. I just don't like to let weasely Carolina fans try to think Dean was better than K. It's so much fun hitting that sore spot with them!
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02
I guess if you do not have a horse in the race then it's easy to root against someone elses thoroughbred. -
tommybrownnc Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
Those numbers are accurate but you conveniently leave out others which tell a more complete picture.
Dean winning %: 77.58% (879-254)
K winning %: 75.6% (866-279)
Saying K has only coached 35 years versus Dean's 36 years is misleading because K has already coached 12 MORE games than Dean. Will K win more games than Dean did, sure because he will have coached a lot more games than Dean. K will also lose more games than Dean did.
You also leave out ACC tournament championships:
Dean=12
K = 11
Again, we both know they are both great legends in college basketball, but don't pretend you deal in facts and UNC fans don't when you conveniently leave out the stats you don't like.
— Posted by 4tarheelsExcellent points, 4t. I wonder if we can also factor in how kids stayed in college for 4 years a lot more when Dean coached than after K started. Dean didn't deal with a lot of juniors or sophs going pro early. Or, not as much as K has had to deal with. Some could argue that K has had to reload quicker because of this. I don't know. Also, Dean didn't get players until they were sophs until after 1972 or so. K has had more years using freshmen.
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Dreamchaser Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
Those numbers are accurate but you conveniently leave out others which tell a more complete picture.
Dean winning %: 77.58% (879-254)
K winning %: 75.6% (866-279)
Saying K has only coached 35 years versus Dean's 36 years is misleading because K has already coached 12 MORE games than Dean. Will K win more games than Dean did, sure because he will have coached a lot more games than Dean. K will also lose more games than Dean did.
You also leave out ACC tournament championships:
Dean=12
K = 11
Again, we both know they are both great legends in college basketball, but don't pretend you deal in facts and UNC fans don't when you conveniently leave out the stats you don't like.
— Posted by 4tarheels
Excellent points, 4t. I wonder if we can also factor in how kids stayed in college for 4 years a lot more when Dean coached than after K started. Dean didn't deal with a lot of juniors or sophs going pro early. Or, not as much as K has had to deal with. Some could argue that K has had to reload quicker because of this. I don't know. Also, Dean didn't get players until they were sophs until after 1972 or so. K has had more years using freshmen.
— Posted by tommybrownncGood point TB. I think they should still have the JV teams. Maybe it would cut down on this one year and out stuff.
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tommybrownnc Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
I like that idea, dream, but the coaches wouldn't go for it. They'd rather have them as freshmen (sooner) than only 1 or 2 years later. The coaches are scared that the kid will bolt after his soph year.
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overtonro Mar 30, 2010
Towel Boy
You can not compare. Whole different world of talent today. More athletic, many more talented all rounded players now. 10-20 years ago good players but not like today. But Coach K will go down as one of the best.
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grasshopperrtp2 Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
Sorry Dane.This ? cannot be answered.Coach K is still coaching.Dean is retired.We must wait until K retires to compare.Royhill is correct.K will pass Dean in the next couple years in the record books.If that happens,then K is the man.
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4tarheels Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
I know K will probably surpass more of Dean's records, except winning % and head to head of course, and I'm okay with that. They are both great coaches with legendary careers, but I'll take Dean Smith any day of the week. He is the man as far as I'm concerned. GO HEELS!
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grasshopperrtp2 Mar 30, 2010
Sports Legend
Greatest coach ever....John Wooden.
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kennywalters Mar 31, 2010
Sports Legend
There is no way to really answer this question definitively which is the point we had finally reached before BDF chose to resurrect the thread. You can't quantify greatness. We can trade numbers back and forth all day in support of either coach. Duke fans can trot out the stats that benefit the K argument. UNC fans can trot out the stats that benefit the Dean argument. In the end, it is a matter of opinion. UNC fans and Duke fans will both be biased in this issue as a result.
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4tarheels Mar 31, 2010
Sports Legend
Comparing number of years coached is not a PERFECT common denominator when discussing games won, a record that K is likely to break next year. Comparing number of games coached IS a perfect common denominator. Nothing fuzzy about that just math.
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Dreamchaser Mar 31, 2010
Sports Legend
I can't believe I'm saying this but I agree with BDF . Put out all the stats that you want, it really doesn't matter. It comes down to a point of view. It's like religion, you can't change someones mind unless they want to change yet people still love to discuss and debate it. Plus there are people here now that were not when this was first posted, so they want a say in it. Now excuse me, I need to go gargle and get this bad taste out of my mouth:)
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kennywalters Mar 31, 2010
Sports Legend
There hasn't been much discussion and really more of the typical posturing from both sides. I seek the happy medium that comes with recognition that this is a question of opinion and not a question of fact. Both sides can produce measurables to support their opinion, but, in the end, they're still just opinions.
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4tarheels Apr 1, 2010
Sports Legend
Here some more too...
ACC record:
Dean : 364-136 = 72.8% winning percentage
K : 309-134 = 69.75% winning percentage
K's ACC tournament results:
Before Dean's retirement: 3-14
After Dean's retirement: 9-4
This has been fun but after going from one stat to the next, it becomes apparent that you really can't compare these two coaches apples to apples because the game has changed so much over the years. The number of teams in the tournament, the number of teams in the conference, the number of games played, who's allowed in the tournament. It's like comparing Babe Ruth to Barry Bonds, not the same circumstances. I feel like Dean is the greatest coach of his generation/era, and Coach K is the greatest coach of his generation/era. -
fouroaksboys Apr 1, 2010
All Star
To answer that question you would have to ask yourself if Roy had Deans teams how many NCAA championship trophies would he have? If you're honest you would say more than 2 anyway. Dean was lucky to have two. We seem to forget that if it wasn't for a T given for calling too many time outs he would only have one. And the other was won by a last second jumper by MJ.
As a matter of fact Coach K has won more titles with much less talent than Dean had on his championship teams. If you really look at the talent Dean squandered, K and Roy way better coaches.
— Posted by mickhall64how do you get dean would have only had one national title had webber not called that time out, were you watching the game and do you realize who had the 2 point lead when webber called that time out? it was unc, how do you know that michigan would have scored to tie or take the lead had webber not called that time out, and before we get to that , how about the greatest non called walk of alltime not called on webber on the rebound ?
get a life goofie -
leballen Apr 4, 2010
Towel Boy
There is no question who is the greatest coach. It's Dean Smith. He is one of, if not the most, innovative coaches ever. Other coaches have adopted his strategies and ideas. He invented the 4 corners (like it or not, it worked). He was the first to save his time outs and the first to play offense-defense at the end of the game. Now, all the coaches are doing it. He had good players, because he was a great recruiter. He won SO many games without the 3-second clock. Duke seems to rely, mostly, on that. I'm not saying Duke isn't good, they are (this year). Not real championship material, though. Dean was great with his players and they respected him. He made them walk a chalk line & didn't put up with any junk. He made men out of them. Coach K isn't even in the same league with Dean Smith.
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tommybrownnc Apr 4, 2010
Sports Legend
Leballen, after tomorrow night, you might be right about that.
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Tizu Apr 5, 2010
Sports Legend
Dayum! lol NICE tommybrown!
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Bassin731 Apr 5, 2010
Sports Legend
if duke wins tonight, he`ll still only be "one of" the greatest coaches, along with Dean Smith
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Thor Apr 5, 2010
Veteran
Now that's funny right there!!! Coach K is far superior to queen smith, and that is of today...When tomorrow comes and K has twice the NCAA chips as smith, I don't want to hear that comparison again...
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kennywalters Apr 5, 2010
Sports Legend
Now that's funny right there!!! Coach K is far superior to queen smith, and that is of today...When tomorrow comes and K has twice the NCAA chips as smith, I don't want to hear that comparison again...
— Posted by Thorqueen?
Really?
Thor, you're such a lout. -
kennywalters Apr 5, 2010
Sports Legend
if duke wins tonight, he`ll still only be "one of" the greatest coaches, along with Dean Smith
— Posted by Bassin731Pretty much.
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View quoted thread
Your exact words were "make a basket and hold the ball for the last 39 1/2 minutes". That implies that UNC purposely held scoring down to win games. I've gone over this before with another blind ABC fan who refused to let facts sway them. I pulled up the scores from the pre-shot clock era under Dean and there were like 3 games where a strategy of slowing the game down for an extended period may have been employed. As previously pointed out on this thread, UNC averaged enough points that the "stall" couldn't have been a major game-long strategy under Dean yet you continue to harp on it as being such. Faced with statistical evidence that completely refutes your claim, you just yell louder hoping to sway people to think the same. You remind me of a lot of our politicians today. Don't let the facts get in the way.
— Posted by kennywalters
It's called making a point, Kenny. If it's a 2-0 lead, or a 25-20 lead, it doesn't change the point that he would hold the ball an inordinate amount of time JUST BECAUSE the rules would let him.
Like I said, basketball the way God intended it.
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02
Once again, UNC's scoring averages refute your assertion. Don't let the facts change it though.
— Posted by kennywalters
There is no statistic you can present that will refute that Carolina simply held the ball for inordinate periods of time to help them win games.
If only we could go back in time and install a shot clock and see what the genius would do then. But we already know. It would force Carolina to actually PLAY the game of basketball.
I'm gone.
— Posted by TruthBKnown Banned Again02